tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2466197097331085013.post8735386759362735963..comments2023-10-22T01:44:55.177-07:00Comments on Bishop Greg Rickel: Lambeth, July 29thBishop Greg Rickelhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05997339078221111137noreply@blogger.comBlogger5125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2466197097331085013.post-39950809331851528962008-07-31T13:29:00.000-07:002008-07-31T13:29:00.000-07:00I wasn't going to jump in on this one, but seem to...I wasn't going to jump in on this one, but seem to be compelled to do so. Whether that's in response to hitherto undiagnosed OCD, or the leading of the Spirt, I'll let the reader decide. <BR/><BR/>Having read ++Rowan's speech in its entirety, I would have to say it's a better representation of current concerns than media stories would indicate, and the concept of "center" as he sees it ("The heart of our identity as Anglicans"), a worthy precept.<BR/><BR/>However, it is difficult for me to see the two "sides" he presents as morally equivalent. Our detractors would see us as consumed with the need for "acceptance," but for the Christian who has reconciled spirituality and sexuality, "acceptance" by others is irrelevant. <BR/><BR/>Our angst, and I think that +Gene is an example of this, is not for ourselves, but for those who still labor under burdens that are not theirs to carry. Our efforts are for those yet to come, so that they know the love of God. All out are in free, and that is very good news. <BR/><BR/>Though I do not want to diminish the danger to those who support glbt individuals in other lands, to distance oneself from "undesirables" because of fear of those with religious "authority" or political power is just not the Gospel. That is neither good nor news to the "captive." Here's a place for mission, and we shrink from it? If we mean what we say, how do we place ourselves in harm's way for others? If +Rowan's assessment of this perspective is correct, Christian leaders are sleeping at night knowing that though they should be ministering to the rejected, since they are not, at least they kept their flock safe. <BR/><BR/>While most, not all, glbt individuals in the US and Canada are safe from physical harm, many know the spirituality-strangling emotional abuse and rejection from the faith homes of their youth. However, speaking from personal experience, in the life of the believer, there must come a point when truth becomes the "coin of the realm", and of much greater value than artifice for the sake of keeping others happy with and about one within the safety of ecclesiastical walls. The suggestion that such things are "innovations", I must say, seems to indicate a lack of understanding of the depth of the journey, and diminishes the leading of the Spirit.KJhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15701224049914946896noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2466197097331085013.post-42417383847420836332008-07-30T11:25:00.000-07:002008-07-30T11:25:00.000-07:00About speaking from the center, this is what ++Row...About speaking from the center, this is what ++Rowan means by that:<BR/><BR/>"And the answer, I hope, is that we speak from the centre. I don't mean speaking from the middle point between two extremes — that just creates another sort of political alignment. I mean that we should try to speak from the heart of our identity as Anglicans; and ultimately from that deepest centre which is our awareness of living in and as the Body of Christ."<BR/><BR/>This is from ++Rowan's <A HREF="http://www.episcopalchurch.org/79901_99498_ENG_HTM.htm" REL="nofollow">second presidential address to the Lambeth Conference</A>.<BR/><BR/>Bob Chapmanrrchapmanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15832559778340592981noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2466197097331085013.post-52068319271630690652008-07-30T11:14:00.000-07:002008-07-30T11:14:00.000-07:00No, Rowan Cantaur gets it. Events for this day pro...No, Rowan Cantaur gets it. Events for this day proves it.<BR/><BR/>To be understood, you have to speak in a language the other person can comprehend. If 100 men left the tent, the message about power and abuse struck home. <BR/><BR/>Now the bishops of the US, Canada, Australia, and other so-called liberal places have the common language to communicate with the other bishops. <BR/><BR/>I would suggest you read this <A HREF="http://episcopalchurch.typepad.com/lambethjournal/2008/07/seeing-with-new.html" REL="nofollow">entry from another blog</A>.rrchapmanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15832559778340592981noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2466197097331085013.post-10196015588423314292008-07-29T19:53:00.000-07:002008-07-29T19:53:00.000-07:00+Greg, I don't really think the Archbishop of Cant...+Greg, I don't really think the Archbishop of Canterbury is getting it. You have heard about the 19-year-old man who is in critical care in Liverpool from a beating he took yesterday because he's gay? The violence is not just in Africa: it's swirling around you.<BR/><BR/>So I wonder how the Archbishop can say "Mutual generosity : part of what this means is finding out what the other person or group really means and really needs" while +Gene is standing right outside the door and isn't asked in and that 19-year-old is in critical care partly because the people like the Archbishop who could make a difference as to how gay people are regarded are pushing him away or refusing to hear him, won't acknowledge him as fully human, fully divine, fully able to realize the ministry to which he is called, fully deserving of all the the love, respect, and generosity open to us all in the Heart of the Host.<BR/><BR/>The Archbishop is asking you to find the center. Well, that center is present in that young man as well as in the Archbishop. Why should he be denied full inclusion in the life of the church while the Archbishop is welcomed in?<BR/><BR/>Yes, African Christians are being hurt by Muslim fundamentalists (and there are plenty of gay Muslims). But isn't the way forward trying to rid the world of discrimination against GLBT people rather than institutionalize it further?<BR/><BR/>--sheila stanley--Macrobiushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09188456616686757899noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2466197097331085013.post-59293455481965077702008-07-29T17:13:00.000-07:002008-07-29T17:13:00.000-07:00Greg, I appreciate the authenticity of your commen...Greg, I appreciate the authenticity of your comments. The Lambeth experience sounds tremendous. It is very challenging to remain open in the midst of such diversity, both because it is exhausting and exhilarating. Thank you for helping us to appreciate the events from the "inside." I look forward to hearing more upon your return. Blessings, Jane MaynardUnknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06453666775366177718noreply@blogger.com